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["Ye, Zhenyu" <yezhenyu AT uic.edu>]

Thanks for the confirmation, Ziyue,

As we chatted offline, I am wondering if this can be explained by the combined effect of different MaxAdcTimeBin for different triggers, and different mixtures of triggers among the runs in sample (A) but the same mixture of triggers among the runs in (B). 

This can be checked by doing a trigger selection for sample (A) and remake the plots.

Zhenyu

On Jun 1, 2023, at 1:13 PM, Ziyue Zhang <zzhan70 AT uic.edu> wrote:

Hi Zhenyu,

Yes, this is what I see

sample (A) includes most runs with laser triggers, and (B) includes only one run with laser trigger. The MaxAdcTimeBin distributions for some APVs In (A) were unstable, but the MaxAdcTimeBin distributions for the same APVs In (B) were stable

Ziyue 

On Thu, Jun 1, 2023 at 12:47 AM Ye, Zhenyu <yezhenyu AT uic.edu> wrote:

Hi Ziyue,

Do I understand correctly that 

You checked MaxAdcTimeBin distributions in two run samples, sample (A) includes most runs with laser triggers, and (B) includes only one run with laser trigger. The MaxAdcTimeBin distributions for some APVs In (A) were unstable, but the MaxAdcTimeBin distributions for the same APVs In (B) were stable

Zhenyu

On Jun 1, 2023, at 4:35 AM, Visser, Gerard <gvisser AT indiana.edu> wrote:

Hi Zhenyu,

   Ok, thanks... To flip back to our earlier discussion then from point 2 below, if the ADC did saturate that would be a problem then. I think all the online plots I've seen look pretty fine despite the rather high pedestal setting. But someone should make (1-d of selected channels?) ADC plots from all data from a typical run rather than just from the online plots sample, I would say, to be sure that you don't have an issue with saturation.

    As far as the latency tuning, maybe by taking the max instead of using the 2^nd sample of the 3 always, any small change in timing is not as much of a problem. Hard to guess really. Anyway it is good to have the clarification how it is being done. For the timing I hope we can keep a close eye on it as Ziyue has been, and I think things will be ok.

    Sincerely,

          Gerard

---

From: Ye, Zhenyu <yezhenyu AT uic.edu>
Sent: Wednesday, May 31, 2023 10:02 PM
To: Visser, Gerard <gvisser AT indiana.edu>
Cc: Zhang, Ziyue <zzhan70 AT uic.edu>; Aschenauer Elke-Caroline <elke AT bnl.gov>; flemming videbaek <videbaek AT bnl.gov>; Star-fst L <star-fst-l AT lists.bnl.gov>
Subject: Re: [Star-fst-l] FST Latency Adjusted

 

Hi Gerard

We use the maximum adc from the time bin with the maximum adc among all the time bins, the same as we have done for IST.

These ADC values are used in the following ways

1. Decide whether or not there is a hit by comparing to thresholds

2. Calculate the hit position based on ADC-weighted center position

The tracking code is under development. I don’t think it is suitable to run AuAu data. For pp, we were able to get an estimate of 

efficiency by assuming straight tracks and looking in a relatively large window (a few strips) from zero-field data.

Zhenyu

On May 31, 2023, at 4:25 AM, Visser, Gerard <gvisser AT indiana.edu> wrote:

hi Ziyue,

    Thanks for the slides / plots. If this set of runs is reasonably typical, it looks fine and we shouldn't worry too much. On the other hand though I don't know any reason why laser runs should be any different than any other run for FST. Certainly it is very hard to understand an effect on some but not all APV's in laser runs vs. non-laser runs.

     Can someone explain what do we do in analysis/tracking with the 3-timebin data? Are we using always the sample of the middle timebin and ignoring the first and last? Or do we use the max timebin considered independently on each channel of each event? The former way is what I would expect. Also, Zhenyu I think said we just compare the one sample point to a threshold to say hit or not hit, and nothing more than that is done with the ADC data? Did I understand that right?

     Some early confirmation that tracking and efficiency is OK would be really great. Is that in any way feasible?

    Sincerely,

       Gerard

---

From: Ziyue Zhang <zzhan70 AT uic.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2023 8:50 PM
To: Visser, Gerard <gvisser AT indiana.edu>; Aschenauer, Elke <elke AT bnl.gov>; Ye, Zhenyu <yezhenyu AT uic.edu>; videbaek <videbaek AT bnl.gov>
Cc: Star-fst L <star-fst-l AT lists.bnl.gov>
Subject: Re: [Star-fst-l] FST Latency Adjusted

 

Hello all,

I went over the shift log and found that, the 2 examples I provided in the previous emails were both covered partly by many laser runs. Could this be the cause of the MTB shift?

I've also looked over 3hrs of 6 consecutive "long" runs (with only one run was a laser run), and have gone over some "interesting" APVs (aka, those I touched and those presented themselves suspicious in those 6 runs). I don't see any noticeable shift in these runs. Please take a look at the slides: WatchList.pdf

Sincerely,

Ziyue

On Tue, May 30, 2023 at 3:11 PM Aschenauer, Elke <elke AT bnl.gov> wrote:

I agree with Gerard, we need to know how many of the chips are going this and how many are not.

Cheers elke

On May 30, 2023, at 15:07, Visser, Gerard <gvisser AT indiana.edu> wrote:

I guess the major question is, are these two exceptional chips or do they all do this?

And the other question is, if people want to worry about this and investigate more, are we going to do some 5-tb (or more) running to see better what might be happening>

        Gerard

---

 

From: Ziyue Zhang <zzhan70 AT uic.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2023 1:39 PM
To: Visser, Gerard <gvisser AT indiana.edu>
Cc: Star-fst L <star-fst-l AT lists.bnl.gov>
Subject: Re: [Star-fst-l] FST Latency Adjusted

 

Hello Gerard,

  Another example which is easy to track is RDO2_ARM1__PORT1_APV7. This one was also only touched yesterday.

<image.png>

<image.png>

<image.png>

<image.png>

<image.png>

<image.png>

Accident

<image.png>

<image.png>

<image.png>

New pedestal taken

<image.png>

<image.png>

<image.png>

etc... It got worse, by the time I decided to do something:

<image.png>

On Tue, May 30, 2023 at 11:33 AM Visser, Gerard <gvisser AT indiana.edu> wrote:

hi Ziyue,

     Interesting. Is this a typical case, or is this APV exceptional?

    Really, if we have concerns -- I say perhaps we do -- we should run a bit with 5 timebins at least, see what that looks like. Also good to do this with fewer bunches filled, we have this opportunity, right?

        Gerard

---

 

From: Star-fst-l <star-fst-l-bounces AT lists.bnl.gov> on behalf of Ziyue Zhang <zzhan70 AT uic.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, May 30, 2023 11:27 AM
To: Ye, Zhenyu <yezhenyu AT uic.edu>
Cc: Star-fst L <star-fst-l AT lists.bnl.gov>
Subject: Re: [Star-fst-l] FST Latency Adjusted

 

I'm taking RDO3_ARM1_PORT1_APV7 as an example, and I'm choosing from the PHYS runs with close to 30 min run time.

147003:<image.png>

147004:<image.png>

147005:<image.png>

147008:<image.png>

147015:<image.png>

147016:<image.png>

147021:<image.png>

147024:<image.png>

Accident happened after 147025.

147066:<image.png>

During this period of time, the LAT on this APV was not ever changed.

On Tue, May 30, 2023 at 4:58 AM Ye, Zhenyu <yezhenyu AT uic.edu> wrote:

No, I don’t expect APV timing shift due to that incident that the shifter forgot to turn off the FST 

when the beam was terminated (I told Ziyue it is impossible). There could be other reasons like 

these APVs were on the edge and so a small fluctuation led to different conclusion. It will be 

good to see how the MaxAdcTimebin plots for those APVs evolved over the last few days when 

the latency setting was changed.

Zhenyu

On May 29, 2023, at 10:45 PM, videbaek <videbaek AT bnl.gov> wrote:

Hi,

The APV chips are really much more radiation hardened as they were desing and used for LHC.
Too, I do not recall we ever have seen such shifts with APV chips for either IST or FST last year. I might be wrong,. Zhenyu can you confirm if we have seen such behavior ever before


best Flemming





On 2023-05-29 16:06, Visser, Gerard wrote:

hi Ziyue,
    It is also possible, of course, that the max timebin plot is just
generally unstable i.e. not that it moved in response to a particular
beam incident. That _might_​ be the case, we should watch out for
the possibility. (If it is like that, probably adjustments each time
it changes is not the right approach, though I can't say for sure.)
* Gerard
-------------------------
From: Ziyue Zhang <zzhan70 AT uic.edu>
Sent: Monday, May 29, 2023 3:36 PM
To: Visser, Gerard <gvisser AT indiana.edu>
Cc: Star-fst L <star-fst-l AT lists.bnl.gov>
Subject: Re: [Star-fst-l] FST Latency Adjusted
Hello Gerard,
Thank you for bringing up your concern. A minor clarification, I
should have used the word "accident"...
You are absolutely correct, I forgot the power cycle step; that will
be on my top list next time.
In the case of the current situation, this is my naive understanding:
since there was already a trip on every channel, and during the 1-2
days, the shift crews have turned on and off the FST multiple times,
so they should effectively have gone over power cycle... I checked the
Max Time Bin plots yesterday late afternoon, and noticed this issue,
but there was no beam, so I checked again this morning and made the
adjustment based on the plot in this morning's PHYS runs.
Sincerely,
Ziyue
On Mon, May 29, 2023, 12:11 Visser, Gerard <gvisser AT indiana.edu>
wrote:

Dear Ziyue,
Thanks, this sounds good. (I didn't look at plots right now,
sorry, but I trust you see the correct effects.)
However I am concerned by the statement " New APVs need
adjustment found, which is most likely caused by the "FST not off
during beam dump" incident yesterday":
* It should be basically impossible to have any lasting effect of
this sort from any beam incident. I'd expect if there is a lasting
effect, it would be in the nature of total failure or of an increase
in noise level.
* On the other hand though, the hardware _might at any time get
into a "upset" condition_, where some internal states are incorrect
and this might (not unlikely) be caused by beam conditions. It would
go back to normal upon a power cycling of everything.
* ==> If you think something shifted or is acting abnormally, power
cycle!
* If you readjusted something to make it normal instead, I suggest
power cycle and check things, and if necessary make adjustments
(maybe contrary to prior adjustments.
Sincerely,
Gerard
-------------------------
From: Star-fst-l <star-fst-l-bounces AT lists.bnl.gov> on behalf of
Ziyue Zhang <zzhan70 AT uic.edu>
Sent: Monday, May 29, 2023 11:40 AM
To: Star-fst L <star-fst-l AT lists.bnl.gov>
Subject: [Star-fst-l] FST Latency Adjusted
Dear all,
The FST APV latency has been adjusted. Details can be found here
[1].
Best regards,
Ziyue

Links:
------
[1] https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url="https%3A%2F%2Fdrupal.star.bnl.gov%2FSTAR%2Fblog%2Fzyzhang%2FFST-Operation-Log-May-10-July-4-2023&data=05%7C01%7Cyezhenyu%40uic.edu%7C575988fd6ee0480f97f508db60859538%7Ce202cd477a564baa99e3e3b71a7c77dd%7C0%7C0%7C638209899096443526%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=dWP1MonNRHxNXP66jK9M7pLozbRRyLFUFPhuksFSojY%3D&reserved=0
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