Hi Helen, Raghav et al,
If there is consensus on a formulation for the groomed mass fraction on p8 (latest version), please let us know and we can update accordingly.
Thanks
Joern
From:
Star-hp-l <star-hp-l-bounces AT lists.bnl.gov> on behalf of Nihar Sahoo via Star-hp-l <star-hp-l AT lists.bnl.gov>
Date: Saturday, March 25, 2023 at 7:11 AM
To: Helen Caines <helen.caines AT yale.edu>
Cc: STAR HardProbes PWG <star-hp-l AT lists.bnl.gov>
Subject: Re: [Star-hp-l] (version-4) STAR presentation by Monika Robotkova for Hard Probes 2023 submitted for review
[EXTERNAL]
Hello Helen,
Thank you for your comments.
I have implemented all your suggestions in version-4.
https://drupal.star.bnl.gov/STAR/presentations/Hard-Probes-2023/STAR-Experimental-Highlights
Regards
Nihar
On 2023-03-25 03:16, Helen Caines wrote:
> Hi Nihar, Joern
>
> This looks pretty good now, thanks for all the hard work. A few more
> comments/questions
>
> Slide 2: It would be nice to highlight on this slide what data will be
> shown at this conference, its quite a bit
>
> Slide 6: the statement seems to have become garbled it should say
>
> Transition region at Delta(R)* pT_jet = 2-3 GeV for all jet pT
> —> Confinement of quark/gluon degrees of freedom into hadrons occurs
> at universal momentum scale
>
> I don’t know what (tbf) means
>
> I think Andrew has one more correction after the good suggestion to
> change the theory credit to K. Lee et al.
>
> For slide 7 I just sent around a compromise statement I think all can
> agree on at this point.
>
> Slide 9: the title is a bit weird. Aren’t we always trying to model
> reality?
> Maybe Confronting models with data:
>
> Slide 11: for the Raa plot, what do you mean by there is no energy
> dependence? We can’t tell from what is shown there as it is all at
> 200 GeV.
> I think the caption should read
>
> Suppression driven by <N_part>
> - energy density more of a driver of average quenching than initial
> geometry
>
> Why do you have the question "Consistent picture with jet
> measurements?” what do you think is inconsistent?
>
> Slide 12: Highest precision on J/ψ measurement at RHIC energies —>
> Highest precision J/ψ measurement at RHIC energies to date
>
> Slide 13: The left plot is missing the sqrt(s) energy
>
> Slide 15: I suggest Sufficient QGP temperature to melt states at RHIC
> —> Sufficient QGP temperature to melt states at top RHIC energies
>
> Slide 16: Why do you have “almost” in the following sentence
> "Almost the same level of jet and J/ψ suppression as seen in
> Au+Aucollisions;” Within errors it is the same at the same Npart,
> which means its significantly less in central Isobar than central
> Au-Au
>
> Suggest "Observed different manifestation of jet-medium…” —>
> “Probe different manifestations of jet-medium …” since we
> don’t claim to definitively see jet accoplanarity or baryon-meson
> differences yet
>
> Helen
>
> ***********************
> Yale University
> Physics Dept. - Wright Lab.
> PO Box 208120
> New Haven, CT 06520
> 203-432-5831
> ***********************
> she/her/hers
> "Life is not about waiting for the storms to pass.
> It's about learning how to dance in the rain." - Vivian Greene
>
>> On Mar 24, 2023, at 4:11 PM, Helen Caines <helen.caines AT yale.edu>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Since time is now short I propose that we go with
>>
>> ""...consistent with angular ordering of the parton shower”
>>
>> In the 3 talks (Youqi, Monika and Joern/Nihar)
>>
>> To be continued after HP, or during for those of us not able to be
>> there:
>>
>> Nihar, its not true that what Youqi is looking at is the first split
>> (that is what Raghav is trying to explain). The Softdrop
>> declustering algorithm is defined to recursively remove soft
>> wide-angle radiation from a jet, so If delta(M) > 0 there has to
>> have been some splitting BEFORE the one that stop Softdrop and has
>> the Rg that Youqi is looking at.
>>
>> Helen
>>
>> ***********************
>> Yale University
>> Physics Dept. - Wright Lab.
>> PO Box 208120
>> New Haven, CT 06520
>> 203-432-5831
>> ***********************
>> she/her/hers
>> "Life is not about waiting for the storms to pass.
>> It's about learning how to dance in the rain." - Vivian Greene
>>
>> On Mar 24, 2023, at 3:06 PM, Nihar Sahoo via Star-hp-l
>> <star-hp-l AT lists.bnl.gov> wrote:
>>
>> Hello Raghav,
>>
>> Thank you for this explanation.
>> I think the picture what you try to say is not what we are measuring
>> here.
>> it may get complicated when we use ratio of dM and M.
>> and also in this measurement we can only say about at the 1st split
>> not subsequent emission.
>>
>> So I am not sure to say
>> SLide:9
>> "...which confirms angular ordering of parton shower"
>
> Hence, It could be Ok to say
> "...which confirms angular ordering of parton shower at 1st split"
> or
> "...which indicates angular ordering of parton shower"
>
> Let me know what do you think.
>
> Regards
> Nihar
>
> once we use dM/M ratio and also
> On 2023-03-24 18:28, Raghav Kunnawalkam Elayavalli wrote:
>
>> Hi Nihar,
>>
>>> SLide:9
>>> "...which confirms angular ordering of parton shower"
>>> Looking at 1st split with grooming we can not say anything about
>>> "angular ordering".
>>> In QCD "angular ordering" it implies "subsequent emissions follow
>>> specific ordering (either space-like or time-like) as a function
>>> of
>>> time".
>>> Here we don't probe subsequent emissions as function of time.
>>> I don't get how do we conclude "confirms angular ordering of
>>> parton
>>> shower".
>>> Please elaborate.
>> These *are* different splittings. Lets take a simple cartoon
>> picture
>> of a jet that looks like this -
>> jet initiating parton - q -> q + g (split A)
>> q + g + g (split B)
>> q + g + g + g (split C)
>> q + g + g + g + g (split D)
>> if you have SD select a ‘first hardest split’ - sometimes it can
>> give you A, sometimes B, sometimes C etc.. it will give you the
>> split
>> that passed the zcut.
>> if you end up selecting split A as your SD, your dM will be 0 by
>> definition.
>> Now, if you select on jets that have a large dM, you will likely be
>> selecting splits B or C or D. but they will still be ’tagged’ as
>> your ‘first hard softdrop’ split. but technically, they are
>> happening *after* split A yes. so they are later in time.
>> that is why, now if we select jets with greater and greater Rg, we
>> end
>> up seeing a larger dM and consequently, a flatter zg shape.
>> Cheers
>> Raghav
>> **************************************
>> First Name - Raghav
>> Last Name - Kunnawalkam Elayavalli
>> Pronouns - they/them
>> email - raghav.ke AT vanderbilt.edu
>> website - https://www.raghavke.me [1] [1]
>> RHIC/AGS UEC member
>> Assistant Professor of Physics
>> Stevenson Center 6410
>> Physics & Astronomy Department
>> Vanderbilt University
>> Nashville, TN 37235-1807
>> **************************************
>>
>>> On Mar 24, 2023, at 7:21 AM, Nihar Sahoo via Star-hp-l
>>> <star-hp-l AT lists.bnl.gov> wrote:
>>> Hello Monika,
>>> Thank you for updating your slides.
>>> I don't have any further comments on all your slides except the
>>> following one.
>>> SLide:9
>>> "...which confirms angular ordering of parton shower"
>>> Looking at 1st split with grooming we can not say anything about
>>> "angular ordering".
>>> In QCD "angular ordering" it implies "subsequent emissions follow
>>> specific ordering (either space-like or time-like) as a function
>>> of
>>> time".
>>> Here we don't probe subsequent emissions as function of time.
>>> I don't get how do we conclude "confirms angular ordering of
>>> parton
>>> shower".
>>> Please elaborate.
>>> Thank you
>>> Nihar
>>> On 2023-03-24 17:21, Robotkova, Monika wrote:
>>> Hello Barbara and Nihar,
>>> I updated figures in my slides and also rephrased some texts based
>>> on
>>> internal discussion. New version is uploaded on Drupal page.
>>> Best regards,
>>> Monika
>>> -------------------------
>>> Od: Barbara Trzeciak <barbara.trzeciak AT gmail.com>
>>> Odesláno: pátek 24. března 2023 2:30
>>> Komu: Robotkova, Monika <robotmon AT fjfi.cvut.cz>
>>> Kopie: Yi Yang <yiyang0429 AT gmail.com>; STAR HardProbes PWG
>>> <star-hp-l AT lists.bnl.gov>; Nihar Sahoo <nihar AT rcf.rhic.bnl.gov>;
>>> webmaster AT star.bnl.gov <webmaster AT star.bnl.gov>
>>> Předmět: Re: [Star-hp-l] STAR presentation by Monika Robotkova
>>> for
>>> Hard Probes 2023 submitted for review
>>> Hi Monika,
>>> I sign off your talk.
>>> Please just update the plots on slides 8-10 with the final
>>> versions
>>> (check with Youqi) and use better resolution plots.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Barbara
>>> On Thu, Mar 23, 2023 at 10:58 AM Robotkova, Monika
>>> <robotmon AT fjfi.cvut.cz> wrote:
>>> Hello Barbara and Yi,
>>> Thank you very much very much for your comments, I've implemented
>>> them and uploaded v4 on Drupal page. I also updated page with
>>> preliminary plots and preliminary request slides:
>>
>
https://drupal.star.bnl.gov/STAR/blog/robotmon/Preliminary-figures-Jet-substructure-observables-mu-and-kt.
>>
>>> Please see my comments below.
>>> Yi:
>>> - p8: I am not sure if it is good to mention "See Youqi's details
>>> at DIS2023".
>>> I decided to leave the text on the slide since also Youqi has
>>> something similar in her slides, but I rephrased it as Barbara
>>> suggested.
>>> Barbara:
>>> - s28: why do you specifically show systematic uncertainties for
>>> z_g ?
>>> It's just an example how our systematics looks like and also the
>>> only systematics plot with preliminary status from previous
>>> presentations.
>>> Best regards,
>>> Monika
>>> -------------------------
>>> Od: Barbara Trzeciak <barbara.trzeciak AT gmail.com>
>>> Odesláno: středa 22. března 2023 5:12
>>> Komu: Yi Yang <yiyang0429 AT gmail.com>
>>> Kopie: Robotkova, Monika <robotmon AT fjfi.cvut.cz>; STAR HardProbes
>>> PWG <star-hp-l AT lists.bnl.gov>; Nihar Sahoo
>>> <nihar AT rcf.rhic.bnl.gov>;
>>> webmaster AT star.bnl.gov <webmaster AT star.bnl.gov>
>>> Předmět: Re: [Star-hp-l] STAR presentation by Monika Robotkova
>>> for
>>> Hard Probes 2023 submitted for review
>>> Hi Monika,
>>> thanks for the updated slides.
>>> Please see my remaining minor comments below. And please update
>>> your
>>> preliminary request to the drupal page with your preliminary
>>> plots.
>>> - Add the conference logo on the first slide and add the
>>> conference
>>> name to the footer of other slides.
>>> - s8: The last bullet, you can add "\beta_1,2 = 0, z_cut,2 = 0.1"
>>> - s8: See Youqi Song’s ... -> More details in Youqi Song’s ..
>>> - s8, 9, 10: use better resolution plots.
>>> - s28: why do you specifically show systematic uncertainties for
>>> z_g
>>> ?
>>> Cheers,
>>> Barbara
>>> On Wed, Mar 22, 2023 at 12:48 PM Yi Yang <yiyang0429 AT gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>> Hi Monika,
>>> Thanks a lot for the updated version. I only have two minor
>>> suggestions on v3 for your consideration.
>>> - p8, p9: the "boxes (yellow, green, and black)" cover the
>>> information on the plot, could you please try thinner line for
>>> them?
>>> - p8: I am not sure if it is good to mention "See Youqi's details
>>> at DIS2023".
>>> Cheers,
>>> Yi
>>> On Tue, Mar 21, 2023 at 12:52 PM Robotkova, Monika via Star-hp-l
>>> <star-hp-l AT lists.bnl.gov> wrote:
>>> Hello Barbara and Nihar,
>>> Thank you very much for your comments, I've implemented them and
>>> uploaded new version on Drupal page. I also made some minor
>>> changes
>>> based on rehearsal at our institution. Link on my preliminary
>>> plots:
>>
>
https://drupal.star.bnl.gov/STAR/blog/robotmon/Preliminary-figures-Jet-substructure-observables-mu-and-kt
>>
>>> and preliminary request slides:
>>
>
https://drupal.star.bnl.gov/STAR/blog/robotmon/Preliminary-figures-request-Multi-dimensional-measurements-jet-substructure-pp-collisi.
>>
>>> You can find my comments below.
>>> Best regards,
>>> Monika
>>> Slide-4:
>>> Right side STAR detector pic, You need to use updated detector
>>> with
>>> forward detectors.
>>> I decided to put there figure from 2012 when data for our analysis
>>> were collected.
>>> From slide7 to 8, it is not clear what is "Rg vs. dM/M at the
>>> first
>>> split" as title on slide-8?
>>> You need to mention before what is dM/M?
>>> People may not remember what is Mg? You need to mention here
>>> again.
>>> I have the cartoon on the right and also the definition of dM, so
>>> I
>>> think it is sufficient to explain it by words. I also added
>>> Collinear drop on this slide.
>>> -------------------------
>>> Od: Star-hp-l <star-hp-l-bounces AT lists.bnl.gov> za uživatele
>>> Barbara Trzeciak via Star-hp-l <star-hp-l AT lists.bnl.gov>
>>> Odesláno: pátek 17. března 2023 8:24
>>> Komu: Nihar Sahoo <nihar AT rcf.rhic.bnl.gov>; STAR HardProbes PWG
>>> <star-hp-l AT lists.bnl.gov>
>>> Kopie: webmaster AT star.bnl.gov <webmaster AT star.bnl.gov>
>>> Předmět: Re: [Star-hp-l] STAR presentation by Monika Robotkova
>>> for
>>> Hard Probes 2023 submitted for review
>>> Hi Monika,
>>> Thanks for the nice slides with a good story.
>>> My comments are below.
>>> - Add the STAR logo on the title page.
>>> - s4: the STAR figure is a bit small. Try to make the text around
>>> it, or just zoom on the detectors that are of interest here.
>>> - s8: it's nice to advertise Youqi's talk. But it's a different
>>> conference and you present here some of the results.
>>> It would be therefore good to briefly introduce the Collinear
>>> Drop,
>>> you can do this on s8.
>>> - s9: you don't need "and dM/M for different Rg" in the title.
>>> - s11, 13: remove "for two different pT,jet bins" from the title.
>>> - s16: try to increase the size of the plots.
>>> - s17: I suggest having the last two summary statements in
>>> different
>>> colours.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Barbara
>>> On Fri, Mar 17, 2023 at 1:18 PM Nihar Sahoo via Star-hp-l
>>> <star-hp-l AT lists.bnl.gov> wrote:
>>> Hello Monika,
>>> Please find my comments on your nice presentation slides.
>>> ___________
>>> General comment/suggestion to all HP2023 and DIS2023 presenters:
>>> 1. Please make a Drupal page for all your preliminary plots and
>>> provide
>>> us the link.
>>> If you have already done that, please send us the link.
>>> 2. While preparing your analysis plots for "STAR preliminary"
>>> request,
>>> please follow the guidance 1-7:
>>> https://drupal.star.bnl.gov/STAR/pwg/common/Preliminary-figures
>>> It saves our time.
>>> _________
>>> Slide-3:
>>> For groomed mass fraction _expression_, the denominator one can use
>>> "M_g".
>>> Is not that?
>>> If yes, then it would be good this.
>>> Slide-4:
>>> Right side STAR detector pic, You need to use updated detector
>>> with
>>> forward detectors.
>>> Please mention what is "Jet Patch trigger"? Or just remove it.
>>> Slide-5:
>>> Title: "Unfolding" -> "Detector effects correction"
>>> …obtain particle-level distribution -> "…true distribution
>>> from
>>> measured
>>> one"
>>> SLide-8:
>>> From slide7 to 8, it is not clear what is "Rg vs. dM/M at the
>>> first
>>> split" as title on slide-8?
>>> You need to mention before what is dM/M?
>>> People may not remember what is Mg? You need to mention here
>>> again.
>>> Slide-11
>>> Please comment on Slide-3
>>> Cheers
>>> Nihar
>>> On 2023-03-17 16:03, webmaster--- via Star-hp-l wrote:
>>> Dear Star-hp-l AT lists.bnl.gov members,
>>> Monika Robotkova (robotmon AT fjfi.cvut.cz) has submitted a material
>>> for a
>>> review, please have a look:
>>> https://drupal.star.bnl.gov/STAR/node/63008 [1]
>>> Deadline: 2023-03-26
>>> ---
>>> If you have any problems with the review process, please contact
>>> webmaster AT www.star.bnl.gov
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Star-hp-l mailing list
>>> Star-hp-l AT lists.bnl.gov
>>> https://lists.bnl.gov/mailman/listinfo/star-hp-l [2]
>>> _______________________________________________
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>>> https://lists.bnl.gov/mailman/listinfo/star-hp-l
>> Links:
>> ------
>> [1] https://drupal.star.bnl.gov/STAR/node/63008
>> [2] https://lists.bnl.gov/mailman/listinfo/star-hp-l
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