star-fst-l AT lists.bnl.gov

Subject: Star-fst-l mailing list

List archive

Re: [Star-fst-l] FST cooling tube leak : We might have a solution

From: videbaek <videbaek AT bnl.gov>
To: Aschenauer Elke-Caroline <elke AT bnl.gov>
Cc: L Star-fst <star-fst-l AT lists.bnl.gov>
Subject: Re: [Star-fst-l] FST cooling tube leak : We might have a solution
Date: Thu, 27 May 2021 17:36:33 -0400

Dear Elke,
Yes it is an improvement, but there is nothing wrong in pointing out
the other considerations that are important.
One can use the next year to look into a better replacement; see how the flow can be reduced (as its already high for the detecor loops) maybe with a bypass loop,
and having filters on the return.

Flemming

On 2021-05-27 17:24, Aschenauer Elke-Caroline wrote:

Dear All,

maybe you missed this but the tubes which have been selected by Yi are
leaking, Rahul and Bob and others have done tests and test.
So this tubes might be compatible with NOVAC and rad hard, but they
leak.
So they are not useable as they are.
The non-flexible ones are no suitable to be put on the modules.
So this is a tube, which was used with NOVAC and is suggested for use
with it. But the problem is using NOVAC and using plastic tubes
instead of stainless steal.

We cannot make changes now, so using a hose whcih is flexible and not
leaking is an improvement. It is not obvious one needs to change them
every year, this depends on the leakage rate. So please submit only
constructive suggestions how to resolve the leakage problem.

Elke

On May 27, 2021, at 17:08, Visser, Gerard <gvisser AT indiana.edu>
wrote:

Maybe. I don't know, not a judgement I can make. It sounds better to
use a novec-resistant tubing.

By the way, all this cooling business is not my worry but in these
pictures including the latest it _appears_ that the tubing is
inserted too far over the "hose barb" on module. I don't understand
why it would be done like that and it looks wrong to me, But it is
hard to really judge from afar.

Gerard

-------------------------

From: Xu Sun <sunxuhit AT gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 27, 2021 5:03 PM
To: Visser, Gerard <gvisser AT indiana.edu>
Cc: L Star-fst <star-fst-l AT lists.bnl.gov>
Subject: Re: [Star-fst-l] FST cooling tube leak : We might have a
solution

Hi Gerard,

That's a good question, but I don't have any answer right now.
We will need to see how the test goes and also need input from Rahul
and Bob.
But it was used in PHENIX for some time, maybe it's fine?

Best,

Xu

On Thu, May 27, 2021 at 4:57 PM Visser, Gerard <gvisser AT indiana.edu>
wrote:

hi Xu,
In such case, don't we have to worry about the resulting
contamination "plating out" elsewhere in the system and causing
trouble?

Gerard

-------------------------

From: Star-fst-l <star-fst-l-bounces AT lists.bnl.gov> on behalf of Xu
Sun <sunxuhit AT gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 27, 2021 4:51 PM
To: videbaek <videbaek AT bnl.gov>
Cc: Star-fst L <star-fst-l AT lists.bnl.gov>
Subject: Re: [Star-fst-l] FST cooling tube leak : We might have a
solution

Hi Flemming,

Bob and Rahul told us the novec will eat up the materials and the
leaking rate will increase with time.

Best,

Xu

On Thu, May 27, 2021 at 4:48 PM videbaek <videbaek AT bnl.gov> wrote:
Hi

Did Rob indicate the rationale for exchange every year. Possible Rad

damage ?
It would be good to know.

best F.

On 2021-05-27 16:37, Zhenyu Ye wrote:

This is good news, indeed.

If it works, it would solve our problem for the upcoming Run.
But it also brings a new potential issue, that we need to replace

the

cooling tubes every year.
If we can avoid it, it will be the best.

Zhenyu

On May 27, 2021, at 2:33 PM, Tribedy, Prithwish

<ptribedy AT bnl.gov>

wrote:

Hello everyone,
We have good news to share with you. With a new kind of tube that

was

previously used by Phenix, we might have a solution to our leak
problem. We need to do more tests, but I think this is a good
progress.

Remember we had the following issues:
• The hard tubes were very stiff, bending radius was large

but had

less leak.
• The soft tubes had major leaks between layers.
A solution came after Bob/Rahul contacted Robert Pisani from

Phenix.

From them we got this third type: Tygon 2001 plasticizer free"

tubes.

With our pressurized air setup, we see NO LEAKS. No more bubbles

with

soap.

Also, it's much cheaper. It costs like $2.5 c per ft (compared to

$20-80 for the previous soft tube we were using).
According to PHENIX experts, they should be replaced once every

year

-- I think that is feasible.

So, we'll get 25 ft of these tubes tomorrow and this way we have

the

full weekend to do the testing.
If things look good in next couple of days and no leaks are

found‚ WE

MIGHT HAVE A SOLUTION.

We will keep you updated.
Best,
Yu, Xu and Prithwish

Prithwish Tribedy
Physics Department, Brookhaven National Laboratory
Upton, NY 11973, USA
Phone: 631-344-8904, 631-344-3853
E-mail: ptribedy AT bnl.gov
<IMG_1320.jpg>_______________________________________________
Star-fst-l mailing list
Star-fst-l AT lists.bnl.gov
https://lists.bnl.gov/mailman/listinfo/star-fst-l

_______________________________________________
Star-fst-l mailing list
Star-fst-l AT lists.bnl.gov
https://lists.bnl.gov/mailman/listinfo/star-fst-l

--
Flemming Videbaek
senior scientist
videbaek @ bnl.gov [1]
Brookhaven National Lab
Physics Department
Bldg 510D
Upton, NY 11973

phone: 631-344-4106
cell : 631-681-1596
_______________________________________________
Star-fst-l mailing list
Star-fst-l AT lists.bnl.gov
https://lists.bnl.gov/mailman/listinfo/star-fst-l
_______________________________________________
Star-fst-l mailing list
Star-fst-l AT lists.bnl.gov
https://lists.bnl.gov/mailman/listinfo/star-fst-l

_______________________________________________
Star-fst-l mailing list
Star-fst-l AT lists.bnl.gov
https://lists.bnl.gov/mailman/listinfo/star-fst-l

_Note: Please do not feel obligated to respond to this message outside
of your work hours._

( `,_' )+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-

) `\ +
/ '. | Elke-Caroline Aschenauer (she/her/hers) =
| `, -
\,_ `-/ Brookhaven National Lab +
,&&&&&V Physics Dept., 25 Corona Road =
,&&&&&&&&: Bldg. 510 /2-195 Rocky Point, NY, -
,&&&&&&&&&&; 20 Pennsylvania Avenue 11778 +
| |&&&&&&&;\ Upton, NY 11973
=
| | :_) _ Tel.: 001-631-344-4769 Tel.: +1-631-569-4290
-
| | ;--' | Cell-USA: +1-757-2565224
+
'--' `-.--. | Cell-Europe:
+49152220025211 =
\_ | |—‘
-

`-._\__/ Mail: elke AT bnl.gov elke.caroline AT me.com
+

+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=-+=

Links:
------
[1] http://bnl.gov/
_______________________________________________
Star-fst-l mailing list
Star-fst-l AT lists.bnl.gov
https://lists.bnl.gov/mailman/listinfo/star-fst-l

--
Flemming Videbaek
senior scientist
videbaek @ bnl.gov
Brookhaven National Lab
Physics Department
Bldg 510D
Upton, NY 11973

phone: 631-344-4106
cell : 631-681-1596

Re: [Star-fst-l] FST cooling tube leak : We might have a solution , (continued)